Changed the oil for the first time today, just over 3000 miles.

Got her up on the ramps, chocked the wheels and got the jack stands in place. Skid plate came off fine, drain plug opens easy and finally get to the oil filter...........

They must have torqued this thing on with an impact wrench as it wouldn't budge. I about ripped my arms out of their sockets wrestling with this thing. I've got one of those adjustable filter wrenches but of course it's too big for our filters. So I run in to the local Auto Zone for the correct size filter wrench. Well the wrench fits the 3506 Fram filter I am replacing it with but NOT the PF 44 filter thats on the Goat. :angry:

By the way the manual says PF 46 and it was a PF 44. What's up with that? Anyone else check theirs?

Anyway it's slightly too big so I use one of those rubber can opener grippers and get it on and FINALLY get the b@$tard off. :friday: But the wrench is now stuck on the filter due to the rubber gripper. :angry: It also would NOT come off. I was getting so pi$$ed by this time I just took a hammer and pounded the h#ll out of the old filter to get the wrench adapter off.

After that smooth sailing. :)

So just a couple of points of interest. Anyone else with the AC Delco PF44 filter from the factory like me? I'm guessing the PF46 in the manual is a misprint then.

And secondly, the skid plate didn't feel like it weighs 15 pounds. More like around 10 or less but I didn't weigh it.

I'd just like to slap the Aussie bonehead who torqued the filter down too tight. It's not like you are torquing down the wheel lugs. Jeesh!!! :blink:

Changed the oil at 800 miles.

Went to my favorite 10 minute lube stop place.

Paid $40.90 for Mobil 1. Their regular dino oil is an $18.95 special.

I was down in the pit the whole time talking to the guys and looking up at the car. In and out an approximately 8 minutes.

Can't beat that. No fuss no muss, quick and painless.....

You cant beat the ol screwdriver through the filter method.

Interesting tid bits, there are lightweight skid plates available, but I didn't think the price justified the weight gains.

Originally posted by Orbit Orange@Oct 9 2004, 10:47 PM
They must have torqued this thing on with an impact wrench as it wouldn't budge.
Maybe those aussies r just to strong for you!

nah Just playing
i like the screw driver through the filter idea though
heard it works like a charm everytime
Why did u put a fram in your car
Fram is the devil of the oil filters

Why did u put a fram in your car
Fram is the devil of the oil filters


I've heard other people say this but I've used them for years and NEVER had any problems with them. On top of that I also like the "Sure Grip" surface that lets me get a better grip when my hands are greasy/oily.

I also thought about the screwdriver through the filter trick too but decided against it as I didn't know how much clearance between the filter and the pickup and didn't feel like ramming something in there and damaging the pickup/drain for a 3 buck filter.

Can't beat that. No fuss no muss, quick and painless.....

I like to do it myself. Let's me bond with the Goat. ;)

I've taken vehicles to the Quick Lube places before and come back wishing I didn't. (Lost air cleaner screws, overtorquing wheel lugs, telling me things like my coolant needs to be changed right after I did it myself. I don't trust the bozos!!!) :(

Originally posted by Orbit Orange@Oct 10 2004, 11:34 PM
Why did u put a fram in your car
Fram is the devil of the oil filters

I like to do it myself. Let's me bond with the Goat. ;)


What's wrong with Fram? What is the best? :blink:

I like changing it myself also...a relaxing saturday afternoon project followed by a nice wash! :D

I've only seen the screwdriver trick done three times and I only did it once myself. The two I watched was with a Fram filter and it worked just great. For me it was just after I got my Mustang and I went to change the oil. Found out the previous idiot had installed the filter for a 302 Ford truck. Same diameter but several inches taller. So much so I couldn't get a filter wrench between it and the frame rail. Drove the screw driver through it thinking it would be no problem. When I went to twist it off, the cheap filter's cover just ripped, and ripped, and ripped. After driving the screw driver through a few times, the top finally came off. Made a big **** mess and still didn't have the filter off. The good news. I could now get the filter wrench on. The lesson I learned is avoid no name cheap filters.

The lesson I learned is avoid no name cheap filters.



Now there is a good lesson to follow. :)

I won't ever have this problem again as I only hand tighten the 3/4 turn after the gasket contacts the pan or so as stated on the filter. I figure if I tighten it, I'll be able to get it off myself again.
:)

I've had to resort to the screwdriver method myself, but that was years ago on a Volvo 122S. What a mess.

Just remember to dab some motor oil on the new filter's rubber gasket before installing the new one.

Originally posted by 04GOATGERM+Oct 11 2004, 04:30 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (04GOATGERM @ Oct 11 2004, 04:30 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Orbit Orange@Oct 10 2004, 11:34 PM
Why did u put a fram in your car
Fram is the devil of the oil filters

I like to do it myself. Let's me bond with the Goat. ;)


What's wrong with Fram? What is the best? :blink:

I like changing it myself also...a relaxing saturday afternoon project followed by a nice wash! :D [/b][/quote]
Well, we took a Fram oil filter apart at the shop, and it's cardboard inside..and didn't look like a very good design. Then we stole (borrows without asking) a Delco filter from the shop, and it looks like amuch better filter IMO. Ill always go with AC Delco oil filters...but that's just a personal Preference.

I looked at a study someone did online a while back, and ever since I'v been a Delco man.

Just remember to dab some motor oil on the new filter's rubber gasket before installing the new one.


Good advice which I always do. :)

Well, we took a Fram oil filter apart at the shop, and it's cardboard inside..and didn't look like a very good design. Then we stole (borrows without asking) a Delco filter from the shop, and it looks like amuch better filter IMO. Ill always go with AC Delco oil filters...but that's just a personal Preference.

I'll have to hack apart my next Fram to check it out. I change every 3000 miles anyway so I don't give the filter that much chance (with up to 6000 or 7500 miles) to goof things up. It's all preference. I've never had any problems and my oil always looks and feels okay after 3K miles.

I'd love to see some pictures of the innards of different brands of oil filters to see just how each designs them. Would be interesting to see. :)

Had the oil changed in mine today with Mobil 1. Shame on me, I didn't check to see what brand of filter they used. I wanted to check out the underside of the car just to check out the goodies. The mechanic was going on and on about the quality of the exhaust system, the suspension parts, the quality and amount of the undercoating, etc. I have NEVER had any mechanic rave about any other car I've ever owned before. This was not some pimple faced kid, either. This guy has over 15 years of experience. When I went back to pick the car up, there was a guy with a newer model Range Rover checking it out. The manager of the shop said we'd better get the car out of there because people kept stopping in to check it out. Made me feel like a proud papa.

Originally posted by Foster'sguy@Oct 21 2004, 10:40 PM
Had the oil changed in mine today with Mobil 1. Shame on me, I didn't check to see what brand of filter they used. I wanted to check out the underside of the car just to check out the goodies. The mechanic was going on and on about the quality of the exhaust system, the suspension parts, the quality and amount of the undercoating, etc. I have NEVER had any mechanic rave about any other car I've ever owned before. This was not some pimple faced kid, either. This guy has over 15 years of experience. When I went back to pick the car up, there was a guy with a newer model Range Rover checking it out. The manager of the shop said we'd better get the car out of there because people kept stopping in to check it out. Made me feel like a proud papa.
Now that's an awsome testamonial! :) Are you registered in the garage yet?

As for the oil filters by what Nocturn and Tamatt27 said I'll trust them and go back to AC Delco. ;)

Too right. I just checked with the mechanic who did the job. Said he used a Purolater filter. When I asked if there were any problems removing the old filter, he said no, none at all.......BTW the shop that changed the oil is a Meineke muffler shop, which might explain the apparent admiration for my exhaust system....I will be switching to AC/Delco on the next go

I had no problem removing the filter.

The PF46 is the replacement for the PF44 filter which is no longer being produced. For some reason they decided the change the number. My GTO also had the PF44 filter from the factory. If I had a leftover PF44 in the garage I would have used it, but since I didn't, I went out and bought a PF46.

I used Mobil One, figuring I'd treat this engine the same as I treated the one in my old Vette.

How do you jack up the car?

Also, I've heard there are warning stickers when you try to do an oil change. What is that all about?

I would look at http://www.bobistheoilguy.com for some info on different filters, oil,. etc.

Bob's Oil Filter Study (http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=000513;p=)

AC Delco filters work quite well, but the fram filters are VERY cheaply made so I would advise against using them.

I use Mobil 1 oil and filters (changed every 3,000 miles) in all my cars and the '87 Olds Calais GT has over 200k on the original engine and has never been touched!!

-Craig

I used a Fram oil filter for the first change. Based on what I have read here, I will not use Fram again. Has anyone used a K & N oil filter; and if so, what is your opinion?

Originally posted by Lorrie Ann@Nov 3 2004, 10:50 AM
How do you jack up the car?

Also, I've heard there are warning stickers when you try to do an oil change. What is that all about?
How to jack up a car (http://www.ehow.com/how_1864_jack-car-safely.html)

Should be all the info you need Lorrie, hope this helps.

I would rather eat a cardboard box than put a FRAM oil filter on ANY engine I own. I have been a mechanic and engine builder for almost 20 years and I have seen and heard NOTHING but bad things about Fram oil filters. I could go on for pages about the the carnage I have personally witnessed that was a DIRECT result of a FRAM oil filter failure. They are garbage. Go buy one and cut it apart, compare for yourself. If you're not using WIX oil filters on your engines, you're not doing yourself any favors. Just my two cents.

Oh and one other thing I noted here...why did that one guy put synthetic oil in his car at only 800 miles? Does he purposely NOT want it to break in? Let us know if your goat begins to consume oil. Would be interesting to know. I have bought several brand new vehicles in my time and driven them far in excess of 150,000 miles, changing the oil every 3,000 miles, using THE cheapest motor oil I can find. I have even taken the time to tear down one of these such engines, just to "see" what the results were. The last one I did this to was a 3.4L V6 from a Toyota Tacoma, had 164,000 miles on it at tear down....had the oil changed every 3k with "el cheapo" oil....the inside of this engine was as clean as it was the day it was new and I was NOT able to find ANY measurable wear on it ANYWHERE. I ran the ever-living HELL out of this engine for 6 years. It never consumed one drop of oil and got the exact same gas mileage during that whole time. You guys can take this with a grain of salt...but I whole heartedly believe that high priced synthetic oil is JUST THAT....it's your money, spend it how you like.

Synthetic oil is expensive and the long term oil change capabilities are a dubious value. You still should change the filter frequently; regardless of brand. However real synthetics (there are only 3 that I know of, the rest are blends with petroleum oil to lower costs) reduce friction and produce a few more horsepower as well as improving fuel economy (if you care). Differentials and gearboxes running synthetics always show a drop in operating temperature and usually engine idle speeds increase, showing a reduction in friction. There's a reason why NASCAR and IRL teams all use synthetics; sometimes rebottling whatever they use to show off their sponsors brand (e.g. Pennzoil). And I have always waited for 1000 street miles or 6 hours on an engine dyno before changing over, just to insure ring seal.

Originally posted by mechanic58@Feb 12 2005, 08:30 PM
Oh and one other thing I noted here...why did that one guy put synthetic oil in his car at only 800 miles? Does he purposely NOT want it to break in? Let us know if your goat begins to consume oil. Would be interesting to know.

My '05 came from the factory with Mobil 1 in it. Guess my motor's gonna blow up soon.

Thought that whole thing about synthetic oil not letting your engine break in was a myth. Anyone else wanna chime in here?

I too have heard not to use synthetic early because basically it lubricates TOO good and keeps the engine from breaking in. Corvettes come with mobile 1 synthetic but they go through a special break in period by GM before being sold.

A lot of auto manufacturers are using synthetics as factory fill in high performance engines these days. Every BMW sold has synthetic oil in it, and the M3 comes with 5w-60 racing oil. Now, the case may be that at the engine factories these engines are broken in on dino oil and then filled with synthetic, I do not know, but if it has synthetic oil in it at the dealer you can rest assured the engine is ready for it. Personally, while I believe a break in period is good for the entire driveline, the argument that synthetic is too slick for a new engine has very little evidence to back it up. IMHO, when you crank a new engine the first time, the piston rings are going to seat then or not at all.

Wanna know a little secret Ls1's &2s come straight from America ready to run.
the best oil filter wrench for these motors is a 1/2" id square tubing with a slit cut in one flat and about a foot of old seat belt material loopes and crushed into the slit.
You place the loop around the filter body wind it up until it grips the filter body stick a 1/2' drive socket bar in the tube and undo. this tool will fit a wide variety of filters. :type:

Bot a new 94 vette, loaded it in truck went to Las Vegas, ran in the Silver State 100 with the mobile 1 they put in at factory. 97 miles at red line 5th gear oil temp was pegged at 480 degrees by 75 miles the sensor cooked and no longer read.Onthe way home we left it off at John Lingenfelters to make it a 383 , HE SAID engine looked like new !

Your engine oil sump is a sewer. Combustion by-products are all the same no matter what oil you use. Since gasoline is a natural product "cracked" from crude oil, it contains not only long chain hydrocarbons but also random sulfur links in those carbon chains. Refining simply isolates a narrow range of hydrocarbons which creates a mixture of various compounds like octane, heptane, iso-octane and the like, but the sulfur atoms are scattered around everywhere.

When you burn fuel, you mix it with oxygen. The carbon and hydrogen combine with oxygen to give off CO, CO2 and H2O. Overly rich mixtures (a virtual thing of the past with computers) can give elemental carbon as well due to an oxygen deficiency. The problem comes from the random scattering of sulfur which combines with the same oxygen to give various sulfur oxides such as SO2 and SO3. If you add some of that water from the hydrogen+oxygen combustion to the SO3 you get H2SO4 which is sulfuric acid. The reason you change oil is not so much to get the metal particles out, but to remove acids which will etch your cylinder walls, rings, cam, etc. Synthetic oils are better lubricants than natural oils but you shouldn't extend oil change intervals just because you are using synthetics.

My philosophy on filters is to pay the price for a good filter (AC Delco included .. what, an extra buck or two?) and be sure. Also, by changing filter every oil change, if you do happen to get one that isn't internally sealed or blows by, you get it off of there before any damage is done. I've used Frams in a pinch when AC's weren't available. Paper works OK if it's the right mesh and if you don't overload it by extending change intervals. There shouldn't be anything floating around in your oil anyway except for chemicals and some micro-fine wear particles.

Break in is a function of wearing in two sliding surfaces as the high spots are worn down to be more or less compatible with each other thus creating a larger sliding surface and reducing heat buildup from the high spots. There is no oil on earth that is so good it totally prevents all wear forever. Any oil will allow break in as high spots WILL rub and wear. The 05 comes with Mobil 1 from the factory, and I assume these LS2s come from Louisville KY from the Vette plant. The owners manual says a 500 mile break in is recommended. I wouldn't argue with the LS2 engineers. :rolleyes:

Vette plant is in BOWLING GREEN, KY.

:rolleyes: You're right, of course. My bad.

I've been running durablend(valvoline) in my 1995 sonoma(4.3 v6) from when I bought it @104,000 miles 7 years ago (it had accurate service done up until then too) and now have 219,000 miles and it doesn't burn any oil(still runs terrific!) When I changed the oil in my gto(went smooth except for stupid overtight filter), Iused mobil 1 and put it in my truck too! I always used ac/delco filters with gm products---works terrific! I will continue to until there is a reason not too! If it's good enough for high end german cars and 'vettes then why not! oils cheaper than parts.

I'v used AC/Delco oil filters for a couple years now, wouldn't use anything else.

had my eye on the K&N oil filter for my upcoming change at 3000 anybody have any experience with these filters?

See my comments elsewhere on filters. AC Delcos aren't that expensive, and they are recognized by GM as meeting warranty specs. Does K&M? Don't know, but why take risks. The filter won't make it run any better, and it gets changed with the oil anyway. I wouldn't give any reason to deny warranty work if you ever need it.