Boy do I ask alot of questions 'eh? There are too many choices in the LS1 GTO wrold. Right now I am between two products. Either an ATI Procharger or an STS Turbo. SO I guess Ill make a list of questions. :D

1. How does the ATI effect gas mileage?
2. If I have the STS, can I still get sidepipes or even split dual exhaust?
3. If I have the ATI, will maintenance be har at all?
4. Which system would shorten the life of my car more, if any?
5. What would these systems do to my warranty?
6. What kind of power gains would I get from the STS?
7. Is it ok to use the STS on a reletavly stock engine if I limit the boost to 0-5 psi?

THANKS IN ADAVANCE!

Wow that's alotta questions. I don't have the answers, but I would love for someone else to give them!!!

1)All forced induction applications should show an increase in fuel economy PROVIDED you have the restraint to stay out of frequent and high boost. Of course a turbo would tend to provided slightly better economy than a SC due to the lack of crank-parasitic drain.

2) I doubt it, but you'll have to contact www.ststurbo.com to be sure.

3) ATI or any type of sealed SC system will require you to change the SC fluid in addition to other vehicle fluids. Using the Vortech system where you tap into your engine oil, means less maintenance.

4) Forced induction and Nitrous are always harder on an engine than N/A. Shortening the life of your car/engine is a matter of how hard you drive it and of course maintenance. The systems are designed to maximize efficiency as is. However, if you tweak the systems without proper adjustments and compensations you're itching for destruction to the motor.

5) This has been discussed ad nauseum on there...just do a search for "warranty" and you'll see several threads on that.

6) Check STS's website. I believe at last check it was 400 rwhp.

7) STS kits turbo size limits the boost.

I'm just going to repeat what I said over on another forum...

I think most people in the quest for more power tend to look at the short term bragging rights of power adding and not the overall package. I was guilty of it myself. I wanted all the go fast goodies for the engine and couldn't even get my stock GTO out of the 14's.

Not to bash others who don't know how to race their stock GTO, but the key to knowing what mods are "best for your needs/wants" is to first know your car. Once you get comfortable driving AND racing your GTO you'll figure out what you want to improve. There are compromises all over the GTO's designs that lower it's aility to accelerate quickly.

I was amazed how much better I could launch just by lowering my tire pressure. Then I could keep the grin off my face once I finally got those friggin' rear bushings updated at the dealer. Now I need a good shifter b/c I can't quickly and consistently powershift 3rd. Or maybe even just a good CAI kit would work for someone else. Summing up, witnessing a stock GTO knock out 13.3, I feel 12 seconds is obtainable with a good driver and key upgrades/mods all around the car. Everyone loves a sleeper, but few people care to invest the time and energy to make one.

But stepping off my soapbox for a minute, I personally feel the GEN III is a superb engine, hardware-wise, and simply needs, tuning, induction (CAI, head, cam) and exhaust work to satisfy all but the ultimate power junkies. Having sold my '71 455 442 when I was 19 b/c it had too much power for me ...I've since been on a mission to find that kind of brutal torque again. But like everyone else, my memory is playing tricks on me and that 442 is FAR more powerful in my mind now than it was then.

Regarding the STS. For overall efficiency, you can't beat a turbo. The price is less, plus the installation is relatively quick and easy. Additionally, based on their basic prototype kit, it doesn't require upgraded fuel injectors. BUT you have to realize, unlike the SC kits which require only a pulley change to get more power, you'll have to upgrade the turbo itself PLUS all the injectors that come standard in the SC kits. Plus the intercooler, which is standard on the SC kits, is optional on the STS which ups the price closer to SC's.

Good luck
:afro:

To add on a bit, where in a turbo is capable of greater power, it is not without its downfalls, turbo lag being one. Compared to a SC with no lag whatsoever, the turbo is bound to be noticable.

But as said to increase the PSI of a turbo you need to change the turbo itself, but a SC is a simple pulley change.

Either is going to be harder on your stock engine than NA, but the engine can be built to handle the extra power without loosing reliability.

some guys that have turbo recommend it but they say the mialage in city and highways are not so good they say a Supercharger is a good choice because it does not raise engine temperature that much on city and highway driving!!!!

+ a supercharger has better all around power!!!

1. How does the ATI effect gas mileage? Not at all if you stay off the gas
2. If I have the STS, can I still get sidepipes or even split dual exhaust? no
3. If I have the ATI, will maintenance be har at all? What maintenance?
4. Which system would shorten the life of my car more, if any? any modification to produce more power
5. What would these systems do to my warranty? VOID
6. What kind of power gains would I get from the STS? I am still waiting for a real good trial period. They are relativily new.
7. Is it ok to use the STS on a reletavly stock engine if I limit the boost to 0-5 psi? Yes it is supposed to be safe. But I do say supposed. Only time will tell.

THANKS ALOT FELLAS! I think I will go with ATI .

It's also worth noting that the SC also requires some of your horsepower gain to drive the unit, and the amount of power needed to drive it increases exponentially with regards to RPM and boost level. The turbo, on the other hand, uses energy that was being wasted as exhaust gas to drive it, resulting in less power loss. The lag with the STS may not be that bad given the small turbo they use, it will be less noticeable with a smaller turbo since there is less mass to be rotated. A friend of mine is anxiously awaiting the arrival of his STS kit with intercooler, I will get him to register here and post his results.

Originally posted by TEK GTO@Nov 24 2004, 04:26 PM
It's also worth noting that the SC also requires some of your horsepower gain to drive the unit, and the amount of power needed to drive it increases exponentially with regards to RPM and boost level. The turbo, on the other hand, uses energy that was being wasted as exhaust gas to drive it, resulting in less power loss. The lag with the STS may not be that bad given the small turbo they use, it will be less noticeable with a smaller turbo since there is less mass to be rotated. A friend of mine is anxiously awaiting the arrival of his STS kit with intercooler, I will get him to register here and post his results.
True but it is a restriction in the exhaust that will cause backpreassure, so saying is "free" horespower isnt really true. It is less parastic loss than a SC true, but it is not without its own.

The power needed to power a SC is dependant on the PSI its running, if its only pushing 6 PSI then its only going to need the amount of power to push 6 PSI, and not an exponential of the RPM. If it makes 6PSI at 3K using say...15HP, its not going to take 50HP to make 6PSI at 6K RPM.

Plus a superchargers is belt driven way more beeter power directly to the belt

and it's better all around + it's 525hp+ when can you get that much safely in a stock engine?

Obviously each system H/C, Turbo, SC and nitrous is about compromise. The two definitive issues with any "blown" application is charge parasitic loss and temperature.

The parasitic loss can be further analyzed when you take into account the whole harmonic frequency and vibrations on your crankshaft. Obviously no issues with a H/C or turbo package. However S/C kits are a different matter. Roots styles aren't too much of a problem with vibration as they are directly mounted to the motor. However, centrifugal SCs require brackets to align the SC pulley with the crank. The integrity of these brackets is what keeps pulley alignment straight. When alignment is out of whack or even just flex from the bracket, vibration at your crank snout is amplified....leading eventually to front seal failure and crank failure. This is why OEM's have directly mounted engine accesssories the block and heads-reducing NVH (Noise, Vibration, Harshness).

Regarding intercooler design, size and location are the obvious solutions to cooling the charge, but what's less appreciated is that the forced air induction unit itself is important. Turbo's obviously generate the most heat and hence require greater intercooling than SC's. Roots style blower generate more heat of all the SC designs, but as discussed previously, retain the most heat due to their placement in relation to the engine. Between the sealed units and oil tapped units, I don't have enough info to make a confident, factual statement. However I DO know that tapped unit will remain as cool as your engine oil (which is good if you have an engine cooler) due to the circulating nature of it's design. Which would lead me to ASSUME, like roots style, the sealed unit superchargers themselves will be less efficient in maintaining a cooler charge to start with, hence putting more dependence upon your intercooler to cool the charge.


:afro:

hot **** you guys are great. I cant thank you enough.