Jason, can you find out what the (south-central zone) final payout for the 2004 GTO's is, now that the 2004 cash rebates are gone? THANKS!

Will do, I will find out later today.

Final payout is $5000.

What exactly is this 'final payout'? I'm curious, because a dealer today mentioned $5K in 'GM money' in his quote to me on an '04.

Dealer cash.

It means that a dealer does not have to disclose the $5000 to you if he does not want to.

New term for me. Does this mean I can offer a dealer $4000.00 less than his invoice and he still makes $1000.00 on the car plus his holdback? If so maybe a 2004 is still in the running for my new car. :)

You are CORRECT!

Originally posted by ingram4868@Jan 8 2005, 12:55 PM
New term for me. Does this mean I can offer a dealer $4000.00 less than his invoice and he still makes $1000.00 on the car plus his holdback? If so maybe a 2004 is still in the running for my new car. :)
Are you looking for anything in particular? Let me know I still have 3 left in stock. Do you currently have a GM vehicle? If so you can get an additional $1500 owner loyalty.

I'm looking for info to have an informed discussion with my local dealer. He has 5 2004 GTO's on their lot and the only deal I've been able to get on the table so far is $750.00 over invoice.

I'm looking for an automatic with a great cash deal. I'd be willing to finance some of it for a few months if GMAC had a finance special like the last go around. Thanks for the help that you provide to the members of New Age GTO.

Jason,
Will you let us know when the dealerships get their Jan. Instant Value Certificates please?
THANKS

My dealer was selling me an 04 GTO for 25.7k out the door. That was on jan. 6th.

Originally posted by ZQ8@Jan 8 2005, 04:12 PM
Jason,
Will you let us know when the dealerships get their Jan. Instant Value Certificates please?
THANKS

How many incentive options do the dealers have, anyway?

I dug and dug, and $24,800 after rebate was the best bona fide I could get. This was a Pulse Red 6-speed, but I don't really care for the Pulse Red over the regular red, or any other color for that matter. Maybe I could get $24,500 at another dealer for another color, I don't know. I'm not moving until I can get $23,500.

What are the 'Instant Value Certificates'?

What I'd really like is the return of the lower interest GMAC financing.

Low interest is great if you are going to keep the car for the term of the loan. If you are going to trade in a couple of years the higher finance cost in return for a great cash deal is not so bad. The reason I say that is the fact that you are paying less for the car so that means your payoff will be less meaning you are less likely to be severly upside down or owe more than the car is worth. I have not heard anything about January instant value certificates.

Originally posted by Z06J@Jan 10 2005, 09:28 AM
Low interest is great if you are going to keep the car for the term of the loan. If you are going to trade in a couple of years the higher finance cost in return for a great cash deal is not so bad. The reason I say that is the fact that you are paying less for the car so that means your payoff will be less meaning you are less likely to be severly upside down or owe more than the car is worth. I have not heard anything about January instant value certificates.

Out of the eight new cars I've bought, I've never gotten rid of one before I've paid it off, so I wouldn't expect the GTO to be any different.

The best loan I can get right now is 5%. I expect I'd finance about $20K, so the interest cost over 60 months is $2645. So a 0% deal would save me $2645, or a 1.9% would save me $1664. Pretty big savings.

I'm guessing the 'Instant Value Certificates' referenced are additional dealer incentives that they can use at their discretion?

usually you get either or...rebates or 0%...in your case hookinunit the rebates and discounts more than offset the 5% intrest you would be paying...at 24,800 on a pulse red gto the dealer might be making $500 on that deal....good luck getting them to lose money on a deal...well than again with '05's breathing down their necks :drevil: might be time to buy!!!

Does the term FINAL PAYOUT, perhaps have a different name for the people on the left coast. My dealer thinks I'm crazy and claims he can only sell me the car at his invoice price otherwise he will loose money. He only has one remaining 2004 so perhaps he is just willing to hold out for that less informed buyer.

Originally posted by ingram4868@Jan 11 2005, 05:14 AM
Does the term FINAL PAYOUT, perhaps have a different name for the people on the left coast. My dealer thinks I'm crazy and claims he can only sell me the car at his invoice price otherwise he will loose money. He only has one remaining 2004 so perhaps he is just willing to hold out for that less informed buyer.

Deal through the internet, buy in a different state, get a cheap flight there and drive it home. Make a little vacation out of it.

Or does CA have some silly laws preventing that? That would explain how the dealers there are able to do what everyone says they do.

I think the GTO is EPA certified for all 50 states, correct?

I know several people who have travelled out of CO to buy 4x4's. Usually to Texas or Oklahoma. A friend is looking to buy a big flatbed trailer, and he's going to Kansas to save $2K on it. The internet makes it easy.

The only issue for Colorado is that you have to pay sales tax on any vehicle brought from another state. In some state, the dealers can not charge you the local sales tax if the vehicle is destined for another state, but other states hit you for local tax, which may be a deal breaker.

OK, for the west region here is what you need to know:
Tell him to pull up admin message number BAI20040845-01 for program 05-31DA-1 . This is the final pay message for $5000.

Also, messege BAI20050962, program 05-31CE is the $1500 owner loyaly program for current GM owners in the west region.

In addition, messege BAI20050936, program 05-31AAA is the $700 accessory allowance for the purchase of an '05 hood, spoiler or grill inserts.

Finally, if you happen to be in the LA area there is an additional auto show bonus of $500, message BAI20050982, program 05-31AT.

If that doesn't give enough information to get you the deal you want, there is nothing on this earth that is going to help that dealer!

Originally posted by cboman01@Jan 11 2005, 11:11 AM
OK, for the west region here is what you need to know:
Tell him to pull up admin message number BAI20040845-01 for program 05-31DA-1 . This is the final pay message for $5000.

Also, messege BAI20050962, program 05-31CE is the $1500 owner loyaly program for current GM owners in the west region.

In addition, messege BAI20050936, program 05-31AAA is the $700 accessory allowance for the purchase of an '05 hood, spoiler or grill inserts.

Finally, if you happen to be in the LA area there is an additional auto show bonus of $500, message BAI20050982, program 05-31AT.

If that doesn't give enough information to get you the deal you want, there is nothing on this earth that is going to help that dealer!

I'm curious about the hood/spoiler/grill inserts.

How much are they?

Are they painted?

Where do I find info on the parts?

Thanks for the specifics. I'll give it another go and see what they say this time. I was willing to fly and drive the new car home during the $5500.00 rebate program but it turned out that you only get it if you lived in that area. California never got that rebate. We were offered a $3500.00 rebate but this final payout sounds like a better deal if they are willing to sell the car at a reduced rate from invoice.

My offer to the dealer is $4500.00 less than invoice. That way he makes $500.00 from the final payout and the dealership also gets the hold back money. I don't have a current GM vehicle and my new GM credit card is still in the mail so I don't expect any help there.

Does my offer sound too low for the end of the model year?

Originally posted by ingram4868@Jan 11 2005, 12:01 PM
Thanks for the specifics. I'll give it another go and see what they say this time. I was willing to fly and drive the new car home during the $5500.00 rebate program but it turned out that you only get it if you lived in that area. California never got that rebate. We were offered a $3500.00 rebate but this final payout sounds like a better deal if they are willing to sell the car at a reduced rate from invoice.

My offer to the dealer is $4500.00 less than invoice. That way he makes $500.00 from the final payout and the dealership also gets the hold back money. I don't have a current GM vehicle and my new GM credit card is still in the mail so I don't expect any help there.

Does my offer sound too low for the end of the model year?

I worked pretty hard to get a quote of $24,500 after GM owner rebate in Colorado for a 6-speed.

Here in CO a couple of dealers told me some cars have a 'Conquest' rebate of $1500 that everyone is eligible for as opposed to the GM Owner only rebate, but they can't be combined.

It must make the salemen's jobs really hard trying to keep track of all this.

Originally posted by honkinunit+Jan 11 2005, 12:00 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (honkinunit @ Jan 11 2005, 12:00 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-cboman01@Jan 11 2005, 11:11 AM
OK, for the west region here is what you need to know:
Tell him to pull up admin message number BAI20040845-01 for program 05-31DA-1 .* This is the final pay message for $5000.

Also, messege BAI20050962, program 05-31CE is the $1500 owner loyaly program for current GM owners in the west region.

In addition, messege BAI20050936, program 05-31AAA is the $700 accessory allowance for the purchase of an '05 hood, spoiler or grill inserts.

Finally, if you happen to be in the LA area there is an additional auto show bonus of $500, message BAI20050982, program 05-31AT.

If that doesn't give enough information to get you the deal you want, there is nothing on this earth that is going to help that dealer!

I'm curious about the hood/spoiler/grill inserts.

How much are they?

Are they painted?

Where do I find info on the parts? [/b][/quote]
PART NUMBER: DESCRIPTION: MSRP
----------- -----------
92181117 SPORT HOOD $1014.29 primed
12499616 GRILLE INSERTS $268.57 don't req paint
12499666 REAR SPOILER $431.43 primed

The hood is the '05 hood. The spoiler and grill inserts are from the '05 sport appearance package (other posts and pics elseware on this site). I did find the spoiler does come in red, black and silver under part numbers ..67, ...68, and ..69. MSRP for the painted spoilers is $550. Hope this helps.

Originally posted by honkinunit+Jan 11 2005, 01:07 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (honkinunit @ Jan 11 2005, 01:07 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-ingram4868@Jan 11 2005, 12:01 PM
Thanks for the specifics.* I'll give it another go and see what they say this time.* I was willing to fly and drive the new car home during the $5500.00 rebate program but it turned out that you only get it if you lived in that area.* California never got that rebate.* We were offered a $3500.00 rebate but this final payout sounds like a better deal if they are willing to sell the car at a reduced rate from invoice.

My offer to the dealer is $4500.00 less than invoice.* That way he makes $500.00 from the final payout and the dealership also gets the hold back money.* I don't have a current GM vehicle and my new GM credit card is still in the mail so I don't expect any help there.

Does my offer sound too low for the end of the model year?

I worked pretty hard to get a quote of $24,500 after GM owner rebate in Colorado for a 6-speed.

Here in CO a couple of dealers told me some cars have a 'Conquest' rebate of $1500 that everyone is eligible for as opposed to the GM Owner only rebate, but they can't be combined.

It must make the salemen's jobs really hard trying to keep track of all this. [/b][/quote]
Before this rumor gets out of hand, there is a conquest program going on right now, but it only applies to specific models and the GTO is not one of them. The loyalty money applies to all models. One thing to consider is buying a junk heap 88 cavalier for $500 and that allows you to get the $1500 owner loyalty netting you $1000 to the good! All you need to get the loyalty $$ is a current GM registration in your name.

I'll be honest, I'm not all that stoked about any of the new body parts, BUT why wouldn't someone just use the $700 to get the grille inserts and spoiler and then sell them on eBay to make another GTO owner happy? Or is dealer installation required and the old parts retained?

Originally posted by honkinunit@Jan 11 2005, 05:04 PM
I'll be honest, I'm not all that stoked about any of the new body parts, BUT why wouldn't someone just use the $700 to get the grille inserts and spoiler and then sell them on eBay to make another GTO owner happy? Or is dealer installation required and the old parts retained?
As I read the program, it does not specifically say you have to purchase anything. The dealer submits for it like any other rebate, so I would assume, if you can find the right dealer, they would just give it to you like an additional $700 rebate. The program just says it has to be noted as an accessory allowance on the buyers order.

Originally posted by cboman01+Jan 11 2005, 06:57 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (cboman01 @ Jan 11 2005, 06:57 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-honkinunit@Jan 11 2005, 05:04 PM
I'll be honest, I'm not all that stoked about any of the new body parts, BUT why wouldn't someone just use the $700 to get the grille inserts and spoiler and then sell them on eBay to make another GTO owner happy? Or is dealer installation required and the old parts retained?
As I read the program, it does not specifically say you have to purchase anything. The dealer submits for it like any other rebate, so I would assume, if you can find the right dealer, they would just give it to you like an additional $700 rebate. The program just says it has to be noted as an accessory allowance on the buyers order. [/b][/quote]
I find it hard to believe that Pontiac didn't write the rebate instructions to cover this issue. You are saying you have seen the instructions to the dealers? And no where does it say something like the rebate is only available on GTOs that have the hood, grille, and spoiler installed? Find it hard to believe it wouldn't say that.

Originally posted by 2000GTPBROTHER+Jan 12 2005, 09:39 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (2000GTPBROTHER @ Jan 12 2005, 09:39 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Originally posted by cboman01@Jan 11 2005, 06:57 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-honkinunit@Jan 11 2005, 05:04 PM
I'll be honest, I'm not all that stoked about any of the new body parts, BUT why wouldn't someone just use the $700 to get the grille inserts and spoiler and then sell them on eBay to make another GTO owner happy?* Or is dealer installation required and the old parts retained?
As I read the program, it does not specifically say you have to purchase anything. The dealer submits for it like any other rebate, so I would assume, if you can find the right dealer, they would just give it to you like an additional $700 rebate. The program just says it has to be noted as an accessory allowance on the buyers order.
I find it hard to believe that Pontiac didn't write the rebate instructions to cover this issue. You are saying you have seen the instructions to the dealers? And no where does it say something like the rebate is only available on GTOs that have the hood, grille, and spoiler installed? Find it hard to believe it wouldn't say that. [/b][/quote]
Just so there is no confusion, I am inserting a copy of the actual program from GM to the dealers. I'll leave the interpetation up to you and the dealer that is selling the car to you. My previous post is just how I read the program.

1. Program number/name/template type/exception:

Program Number:

05-34AT
Program Name:
PONTIAC GTO APPEARANCE PACKAGE ALLOWANCE PROGRAM
Template Type:
05-F 2005 GM BONUS CASH INCENTIVE

2. Program Description:
PONTIAC-GMC IS ANNOUNCING A GTO APPEARANCE PACKAGE ALLOWANCE PROGRAM
WITH THE PURCHASE OR LEASE OF AN ELIGIBLE NEW AND UNUSED 2004
GTO MODEL. REFER TO GUIDELINE NUMBER 4 FOR DETAILS.

IMPORTANT PROGRAM NOTES:

- DEALERS MUST SHOW A CREDIT FOR THE AMOUNT OF THE GM SPO ACCESSORIES
ALLOWANCE (REFERENCING THE ELIGIBLE PART NUMBERS) THAT ARE APPLICABLE
TO THIS PROGRAM ON THE BUYER'S ORDER.

- THE CUSTOMER MUST SIGN AN INCENTIVE ACKNOWLEDGMENT FORM INDICATING
THEY RECEIVED THE CREDIT TO THEIR PURCHASE PRICE.

- GENERAL MOTORS WILL CREDIT THE DEALER UPON APPLICATION FOR THE GM
SPO ACCESSORIES ALLOWANCE (INCLUDING INSTALLATION) AS DETAILED IN
GUIDELINE NUMBER 4 BELOW.

- GM SPO ACCESSORIES (INCLUDING INSTALLATION) EXCEEDING THE ALLOWANCE
PROVIDED FOR IN THIS PROGRAM ARE THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE DEALER
AND/OR CUSTOMER.
3. Program time period:
JANUARY 4, 2005 THROUGH MARCH 31, 2005 (DELIVERED)

4. Eligible models/required options/order types and allowances:
ELIGIBLE MODELS:
ALL NEW AND UNUSED 2004 PONTIAC GTO MODELS EQUIPPED WITH THE
FOLLOWING ACCESSORIES:

PART NUMBER: DESCRIPTION:
----------- -----------
92181117 SPORT HOOD
12499616 GRILLE INSERTS
12499666 REAR SPOILER

ALLOWANCE: $700 (INCLUDES COST OF INSTALLATION)

NOTE: THE ALLOWANCE OF THE GTO ACCESSORIES MUST BE CREDITED TO THE
CUSTOMER ON THE BUYER'S ORDER FORM.

5. Method of application/incentive code/ final date for submission of applications and resolution of rejects:
INCENTIVE ADDITIONAL
CODE REQUIREMENTS
CUSTOMER DELIVERY REPORTING DHA N/A

NOTE: FINAL DATE FOR SUBMISSION OF APPLICATIONS AND
RESOLUTION OF ALL APPLICABLE REJECTS IS THREE
MONTHS FROM THE PROGRAM END DATE.
6. Method of payment
EFT - WEEKLY OPEN ACCOUNT
INCENTIVE CODE: DHA
MEMO DESCRIPTION: 05-34AT ACCESSORIES ALLOWANCE PGM

REFERENCE GM STANDARD TEMPLATE TYPE 05-F:
2005 BONUS CASH INCENTIVE TEMPLATE FOR GUIDELINES 7-10.
THIS IS THE END OF PROGRAM 05-34AT

Originally posted by cboman01@Jan 12 2005, 02:40 PM


4. Eligible models/required options/order types and allowances:
ELIGIBLE MODELS:
ALL NEW AND UNUSED 2004 PONTIAC GTO MODELS EQUIPPED WITH THE
FOLLOWING ACCESSORIES:

PART NUMBER: DESCRIPTION:
----------- -----------
92181117 SPORT HOOD
12499616 GRILLE INSERTS
12499666 REAR SPOILER


Thank you for going to the effort to post the actual notice. As you say it allows each buyer & dealer to interpet it. But reading it appears to make it look clear, to me at least, that to be eligible the car must be equipped with all three of the accessories.

Originally posted by 2000GTPBROTHER+Jan 12 2005, 03:26 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (2000GTPBROTHER @ Jan 12 2005, 03:26 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-cboman01@Jan 12 2005, 02:40 PM


4. Eligible models/required options/order types and allowances:
ELIGIBLE MODELS:
ALL NEW AND UNUSED 2004 PONTIAC GTO MODELS EQUIPPED WITH THE
FOLLOWING ACCESSORIES:

PART NUMBER: DESCRIPTION:
----------- -----------
92181117 SPORT HOOD
12499616 GRILLE INSERTS
12499666 REAR SPOILER


Thank you for going to the effort to post the actual notice. As you say it allows each buyer & dealer to interpet it. But reading it appears to make it look clear, to me at least, that to be eligible the car must be equipped with all three of the accessories. [/b][/quote]
I see what your saying, but this would make a real tough sell based on the prices from my other post. If they installed all three of those accesories including install and paint it would be approaching $2000 minus a $700 allowance. This doesn't make sense based on the '05 only having a $500 price increase and you get the hood, 50 more horsepower and bigger brakes included. I guess it will all go back to seeing if a dealer gives someone the allowance without installing the accessories, is someone from GM going to go back and look to see if the dealer ever ordered any hoods/spoilers/grills through their parts department. I know a GM area sales manager and they do deal jacket reviews at several of thier dealers each month. Usually they are just looking to see that the paperwork was done right and the customer signed the incentive acknowlegement form and the correct incentives were noted on the buyers order. I guess each person will have to find out on their own. I'm waiting to see if my name gets pulled out of the PEP car hat before the end of the month for me to start discussing it in ernest when it's my car and my dealer.